Yes I admit, Im a revolver person. Mountain lions are a specially protected species in California. Considering all the crap I have received from all the internet commandos and bear experts for foolishly using only a 9mm I am glad I was not carrying my Tokarev! Cue the whining about how much of a shame it is to kill such a majestic animal. However many decades ago, I was a PPC competitor. Yea, a revolver and its speed loaders generally only hold 6 rounds each, but it can be reloaded very quickly. 200gr LRN out of my G29 or EAA Elite Match. Even had to qualify with it if you carried it as part of your job duties. Once at night on a fishing trip in the beartooths we had a grizzly fooling around out side the tent, Out I went with my trusty .475 in one hand and a flashlight in the other. and the 45 colts are equal if used in modern stout pistols. Rain, Wind, Snow all those things can and will reduce the effectiveness of Bear Spray much more than they would affect the employment of a firearm. That combo gets exceptional penetration you just have to have a revolver that can handle it like that the Ruger, Freedom Arms, etc. The lion ignored the adults in the group and went right for the children. Ruger, Agreed. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Inside the house, condo, apartment, or indoors such should I call those DGUs as easily as a person on person. Regarding your story about the two men from California who discharged bear spray in their hotel room in their haste to try it out forcing the hotel to gut and refinish the room entirely, of course after evicting the two Californians. How many miles can a mountain lion travel? There was a Professor who during the 50s and 60s working with the US Forrest Service..spent a great deal of time studying bears and bear attacks. Mountain lions actually have the largest hind legs (proportionally) of all the members of the cat family. Shot 3 whitetail doe in the noodle with that rifle, and it wasn,t graphic. wild berries and plums, and of course during hunting season (deer and elk for instance) 10, 9, 8, 7, 6 hes ON TOP OF YOU CHOMPING ON YOUR SPINE and THE BACK OF YOUR HEAD ! I have skinned three browns, two grizzlies and more black bears than I care to remember. A woman was killed by a cougar, in Washington State a couple of weeks ago, while mountain biking. We were given dominance over the animals, and we all got here at the same time. This bit of firsthand experience has made me change my point of view in favor of wheel guns and the calibers they favor. You dont need a laboratory test to confirm that it was behaving strangely. Back in Year later, shot a black bear same ammo, but out of a desert eagle way better results. And ditto even for herbivorous who often destroy and damage crops. chasing after and retrieving spent brass. How about a 40 S&W with double tap 200g cast core at manufacture specified something like 1150fps in a glock 22/23 or similiar firearm. Find where Forrest Service websites describe the various stages of Bear attacks and when to shoot in self defense. It is the gun I used in the American Hunter Challenge Video where I make five hits at seven yards in under three seconds. Thank you! feral dogs However, the realization that you might have to use one to defend against a couple-hundred pounds of teeth and fangs doesnt exactly make one feel like Zorro; in fact, I looked down at it and said to myself:This is gonna hurt. In this case, fortunately, the uncle had time to retrieve the handgun from a vehicle. There are many rifles to go with other calibers that would be nice to have same caliber bullet in pistol and rifle (i.e. Made me wonder Dont these manufacturers know that hard cast is more effective? Perhaps they were just given that name to sound scary, but are really made for 2 legged predators? Ammunition To Go : 50rds - 38 Special Federal LE 158gr. It provides some seemingly good info, but some is just confusing and troublesome. No semi-auto makes the grade except perhaps the .50 AE, but most ammo for that fails due to bullets. I wouldnt recommend anything less than .44 mag or equivalent. Sometimes I carry a .44 Magnum with 300-grain cast bullets, but never anything smaller for bear protection. For more information about Hornady ammunition, click here. Honestly for a Mountain Lion a human does not have a good chance when it comes down to human w/ knife vs mountain lion, but I do recommend he has a knife in case he would be knocked to the ground or a last resort. reviews, Its very light and handy to carry. The capsaicin in the bear spray will act as an irritant and will likely make the animal retreat. My close friend and ex-county sheriff assures me that, unless you are acting like an idiot, most sheriffs here in Colorado will just shake your hand and wish you a good day, IF they happen to see your with a magazine with > 15 rounds. most likely you sleep in your rig also. The cartridge will push a 180-grain bullet to a respectable 1,300 fps, and that little Kimber has a lot to offer. Unfortunately it seems that a sow protecting her cubs, as she is hard wired to do, is killed then the cubs are then euthanized, or as I prefer to call it, killed. The cougar was probably at the end of the rage stage, where attacks on almost anything are common. I found it on the Internet in a read only document. Of course you can imagine the hysterical reactions that suggestion creates.. I have a Springsfield 460 Rowland and 400 CarBon for bears and back cup with 357 Mag in a Tarus 7 shoot to stop any bear. Under normal circumstances, the lion would have returned to eat the prey. A revolver is a one threat gun so unless you are Jerry Miculek you will run out of ammo with a revolver. Disease is a greater concern when lions are genetically isolated as in the Santa Ana Mountains, and could potentially contribute to future decline in that population. The Creator has a great plan, and I do not really miss the dodo bird or the carrier pigeon. I love packing iron, but in a 44 mag, 300 grain load minimum for bigger critters. It was the first handgun I ever purchased.. However, should you have the misfortune of getting between a sow and her cubs, or perhaps meet a cantankerous old boar, the black bear certainly has the equipment to rearrange your anatomy, and even possibly render your birth certificate null and void. The local police department and/or county sheriffs office can also respond to mountain lion-public safety calls to a 911 operator. I am reminded of a survival show that aired a few years ago. The key is putting the projectile in the right spot. First you start off by saying a Judge or Governor is not what you want for bear country, then end by saying you carry a Redhawk in .45 Colt for bear. Both are excellent sidearms but leave something to be desired when confronting big game in the boonies. Hunters killed off mountain lions in the park in the 1930s but the animals moved back in during the 1980s. In most cases, a 22 caliber rifle will not be able to kill a mountain lion. A powerful handgun with a tough, deep penetrating bullet is the key. Not totally true. Funny how there is no mention of bear spray in all of this as it has to be the first option compared to killing and animal in whose domain you have wandered. Most of the revolvers mentioned in this article are double action. No thanks. I would still rather have a 12 gauge though. Why dont you go out in the woods and try out some of your hollowpoints . A .38 snubby? You should first attempt to fire a warning shot to scare off the lion before it attacks. Yes and no.. I recommended getting a .357 Magnum or a larger caliber. Sure, semi-automatics have their place. They have been conditioned to hear a gun and equate it to a free meal. Last I heard the Judge and Governor are chambered in .45 Colt and shoot the exact same rounds as your Redhawk does. Take it from someone who has been nose to nose with many big bears by accident if youre going into bear country willingly take as big a double action revolver as you can keep all rounds in the target black. When I asked him for his thoughts on carry guns for bear country, Phil related the following: Phil, I have always said that carrying any handgun for bear protection is similar to wearing a life jacket in a boat, or parachute in a plane. from the bear. My colleague and friend Bryce Towsley (brycetowsley.com) is a veteran gun writer who has considerable experience with bears of all sorts. OMG! Listed were all the big names but one very powerful handgun was not mentioned. Protect your neck, throat, and head. The bullet entered at the last rib on the right side and ripped through diagonally and lodged in the base of the neck on the left side. Until its needed. I almost needed a new clean pair of drawers. I have never had a chance to stop a bear yet buy was close to one in Yellow Stone park a few years ago when the bear came What to do? Before any bear country hunt I practice with it a lot. Dont immediately dismiss bear spray from consideration. Certain poisons meant to kill rodents, called anti-coagulant rodenticides, end up in the tissues of mountain lions. Colt Magnum June 7, 2018 At 19:23. Its available right now, only in 9 mm, .40 S & W and My hunting partner puts his faith in the Colt .45, and it will get the job done. I dont know anything about bears .but the comment about butchering hogs was funny to me . May 23, 2022 / by / in . I called out local F&G agent. I own several Casulls, but my favorite handgun is a 5-inch, custom Freedom Arms Model 83 that Ken Kelly tricked out for me. They are thin skinned and with a broadside shot would drop it like a rock, with one shot. Jim Farmer Once you get over 300gr. the sidearm nicely supplements the rifle, as a companion piece. He ran to get the gun, and when the animal started to investigate whether P.J.s head was bite-sized, Smith told him to shoot the animal, which he did with one extremely well-placed shot. A long barrel revolver or pistol in very close quarters. LOL. The 7 -inch barrel makes for a bit more cumbersome handgun, but the author feels the accuracy is well worth it. would have killed him by a horrible mauling! Attacks continued and now a lion is dead. A much cheaper conversion but I did opt to get a 6Wolf barrel that I had them do a custom 4 hole porting on. When confronted by a threat.. you need to tick off a very short, well reasoned and practiced list. As most readers are probably aware, a cougar (aka mountain lion) attacked a couple of mountain bikers in California last month [ Outside Online News: January 9 . Its the sick, injured, old one that will risk human contact. is probably better than nothing but foolhardy in my opinion. A mountain lion would win a fight against a wolf. Defensive purse swinging! Im curious as to why you only show five rounds of .45 LC with your Ruger. A perfect shot to the brain may stop a griz or black bear with a smaller caliber but you cant count on a perfect shot every time. A Utah friend of mine called to ask about using a .38 Special with a 4" barrel as a trail gun and a defensive gun in the mountains of his home state. It is illegal to injure or kill them. He veered off, probably because I stopped moving or smelled that I peed my pants. I think that the 480 Ruger is a real sparkling over looked gem. I would also explore all the different kinds ammo available that would be the best for an attack by a bear. When they were hunted with dogs in the 1950s and 60s, many were shot with .22 rimfire cartridges from both rifles and pistols. A doe once got a hoof caught in the top of a cyclone fence, near our property. Ill take the capacity of an auto loader in 45 Super, 10mm or Rowland any day. Mountain lions have a size advantage, a power advantage, and more weapons in their arsenal to kill a wolf. Stay safe in mountain lion country Do not hike, bike or jog alone. I rather be over gun then under gun. I would want a 45 cal or at least a 9mm double action semi-auto with a chambered cartridge every time. 9 shot can shred the head of a rattlesnake up close. Mountain lions dont have a reputation for requiring powerful firearms to put them down.. Jul 30, 2019. The big cats are thin skinned and not that hard to kill. in he he stated that no matter how big of a rifle one has in their hands, when facing something that is fully willing and capable of stomping you into a frothy little puddle of blood and hair, no matter what youve got, its still going to feel like a willow switch. 6+1 capacity, and will group within 3 inches at 25 yds. If I know ahead of time that Im heading into black bear country, I like to carry my big handgun: a Ruger Blackhawk, chambered in .45 Colt, stainless finish with a 7 -inch barrel. You cant load the right ammo for bear defense, but its better than a sharp stick. Mag seemed the best choice, at 100 yds a 375 H&H appeared even better, and at 25 feet a 155 mm didnt seem large enough! We killed about 5 hogs every week he shot them with 22 never saw any that didnt fall over dead. Put up the fishing gear and settled in for the night. I carefully googled this story using the locationImpossible to find any story that confirms that what you said id true. My mountain weapon is a 458 SOCOM, semi-auto, from a 8in barrel, eotech halo-graphic, green laser and 1000 lumen light, with a 300gr lead tip hollow point. Can you show any proof that we are destroying anything? fresh kill 1994 watch online. That being said i would still rather has a single action 44 mag or 45 colt than a 9mm for bear defenseanyday! I probably keep the fine folks at Magpul in business with my 50, 40 and 30 mag purchases. 7.62 mm (.32 cal) out of a necked-down 9mm case. The problem is the gun. Grizzlies make mock charges; black bear do not or thats what the experts say. HSM .45LC 325 grain is a real stopper. Any bear is a big, tough critter and to stop them you will need to penetrate and break stuff like big bones or skulls. When the smoke cleared the bear knew where I was (on the ground) and headed my way. Theres no such thing as overkill. All good options. With a 5 inch un-ported barrel, 300 grain hard cast solids, cut an X on the point with a fine hack saw about 1/8 of an inch deep. Florida State Lawmakers Introduce 'Constitutional Carry', The Staccato CS Brings Real Performance to the Concealed, Meet ROSE: SIG SAUER's Complete Concealed Carry Solution for, Honolulu Issues First Concealed Carry License. He makes a grizzly look like a cub. coyote-wolf hybrids Id wager that Ive walked within feet of bear and cougar many times without realizing that they were there. So far, Ive never seen anything bigger than a hare, but it never hurts to be careful. Worse is the comment on using a .38 Spl in bear country is better then no gun: BS, if your not prepared, dont go! I have two dogs and they said that might provoke the bears. that will allow the bullets to be seated and crimped .100 further out than factory specs. The California Department of Fish and Wildlife has granted a number of these in the last week, The Los Angeles Times reported. Ivy. @ 1,100+ FPS!! Now he is a sports talk radio host for 104.3 the Fan . Yes, the first round was the fatal round but it didnt stop the bear. Ill stick I have yet to set foot in Alaska, but I have many friends and colleagues who either live there, or have significant hunting experience in the 49th state, where encounters with brown bears can honestly represent the hunter becoming the hunted. A large bore hot load can be a challenge to control and difficult for multiple shots, while something like a 10mm in a good semi-auto allows for powerful rounds and multiple shots rapidly fired on target for many. I carry my Ruger SP101 357 on me always, and when camping, I have my 45-70 close by. Robert Rourke famously said, Use enough gun.. And, take the time and professional training to get to know how it feels to defend yourself in a close-combat type of scenario. There are no stopping calibers; only stopping shots. Exceptional combo when paired with the right revolver and load. Companions showed up shooting to save the day. Owing to circumstances at their place, I wasnt able to go. 357. Hollow points sacrifice penetration for larger wound channel . The female mountain lion in a chilling faceoff with a solo trail runner in Utah wasn't trying to kill him. Si saw a black bear last year, and got lost running away from it. Really. WLN LBT even at long ranges with factory twists. The lion had killed the livestock but had not eaten them, The Mercury News reported. I would take a 357 Magnum with hard cast bullets over a standard 45 Colt round. My first handgun was just that at age 18, and now I tote a Blackhawk Hunter in .45, loaded with 325 gr HC with GC and 22 grains of H-110 (Ruger Blackhawk or Thompson Contender ONLY!!!) If you choose bear spray as your only alternative more power to you. Think youre gonna penetrate his skull with your pea shooter? Winchester lists their .410 GA slugs as 1800 feet per second. He shot it twice point blank with his 9mm and the hog just shook its head and continued to walk around. Usually blacktail deer. of course be loaded and kept down loaded with .38 Special ammo (modern). The short barrel clears the holster fast and the Ruger frame is tougher than the S&W. Mace or a .45 Colt? 44 mag power in a high cap auto loader. Does Bear Spray work?.. Found the bullet in the other ear, Weighed 270 grains. The 30-50 yd accuracy is simple.AMAZING SHOT PLACEMENT WITH POWER. These people were lucky they didnt get rabies. The statement that you wont be able to dump a full magazine into a charging bear is likely true as well. My buddy Marty Groppi who enjoys the famous trout streams of Upstate New York carries a Smith & Wesson Model 29 in the classic .44 Magnum, a combination that will most definitely save your bacon. In this case, the mountain lion was found to have rabies. So if its a two shot scenario with a revolver, I can place 4 AIMED shots with my 10mm in the same amount of time. Not handloading right now, so that obvious solution is not available; only factory ammo. A mountain lion has slaughtered 27 lambs on a farm in Northern California but did not eat a single one. I doubt that I have walked past a moose without noticing. One thing that does not get mentioned much is that Y pattern that a charging bears head presents makes for a difficult target to hit. A single action handgun is not a good choice as a defense weapon in any scenario. The police standard is not to let a person get closer than 21 feet with a weapon like a knife, club etc with out being engaged. His wife left Houston shortly after he passed. Ive lived and hunted and fished in Alaska since 1993. I have seen that cartridge fail horribly on black bears and hogs. Im more concerned with the organized gang activity here in Denver than all of the wild animal encounters in the universe. We dont know what caliber, make or model the handgun was. Let's dive right in. killed a mountain lion years back with a 3 inch 629, 240 grain hollow points, was not impressed. Its been years since Ive regularly shot revolvers. As far as I am concerned the best handgun for a person is one they are familiar and competent with. I believe that model Ruger is single action, right? why dont you buy a BB gun for backup. Best of luck, fortunately it sounds like you really wont be relying on luck.. There are too many stories of people getting mauled by bears that charged right through their attempt to spray it, and they could never get to their gun in time once the bear hit. Methinks your anti-Judge/Governor bias is showing. None of the planned gun laws have any impact on bolt-action rifles as far as I'm aware (except perhaps limiting magazine capacity if it has one), and to be extra safe you could get a bolt-action rifle without a detachable magazine. just my 2 cents. Native to the Americas, the puma, also called the mountain lion, cougar, catamount or panther, often shares its habitat with several other top predators, such as wolves, bears, coyotes and jaguars. A mountain lion was killed in the Santa Monica Mountains, becoming the first killed under the state's depredation law, a National . Newsweek has contacted the California Department of Fish and Wildlife for comment. What about a Judge or Governor, that can shoot .45 Long Colt or .410 shotgun shells? Nothing prepares you for the 700 gr hardcast, but Im counting on the adrenaline to kick in. Just no big name in the periodicals. Lets hope that we can all avoid the threat of mauling, but if youre unfortunate enough to have it happen to you, be prepared. AFLoader, the Automated Universal Pistol Magazine Loader, https://www.fws.gov/mountain-prairie/species/mammals/grizzly/bear%20spray.pdf. Live in Alaska. A farmer living in Lower Lake, in Lake County, noticed the dead lambs last week and notified the California Department of Fish and Wildlife.